Curse

Masmar · Jan 25, 2009, 02:12 AM // 02:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Emu

1. 46 DPS is not a lot, an MS/DB is better guaranteed
2. Assassins are NOT more complex, the requirement to press skills in a certain order reduces your possibilities, thus your choices, thus the thinking required
3. A well played warrior in PvP (likely in PvE as well) will always do better than an assassin at any skill level, because it is capable of pulling solo maneuvers to against shutdown and more intelligently releasing its damage to get kills (when used intelligently)
4. conversely, a poorly played assassin is more effective than a poorly played war due to point 2

2. Assassins are more complex, they require you to complete a chain, which could at times be hard. For example some players wont even notice they missed an attack and will hit 2-4 more skills to no effect. You'd be surprised.
3. Assasins are all about solo maneuvers, or chains would be useless.
4. A poorly played assassin IS much worse than a poorly played warrior due to less armour, bad dps, and the player not playing to an assassins needs

Marverick · Jan 25, 2009, 02:14 AM // 02:14

Assassins can use ["Save Yourselves!"] which makes all other forms of defense useless.

Warriors can keep it up easier with D-slash, but nonetheless Sins can maintain it without too much trouble.

Crom The Pale · Jan 25, 2009, 02:30 AM // 02:30

The standard D-Slash build leaves a war with 3 option slots that can be use for party buffs such as "save yourselves" or extra damage skills. Because of his high armor a war can more easily rely upon a monk for healing where a sin must bring some self healing and defencive skills in order to survive.

Masmar · Jan 25, 2009, 02:47 AM // 02:47

DS is good for single target DPS. But can easily be matched by a sin single target chain. But in Pure DPS 43 dmg to all adjacent > ~90 to one.
This only takes 4 slots, lead, offhand, MS/DB, so leaves 4 slots for utility

Improvavel · Jan 25, 2009, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Apples can be red, yellow, green and oranges are oranges. Both taste great when they are good.

Ups and downs on both. Will you be in a disadvantage by choosing a sin over a warrior or vice-versa? Nope (well u might me with retarded teams).

Windf0rce · Jan 25, 2009, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Play both and see which one you like better. Try the most powerful DPS builds and decide it yourself.

For me, in PvE it's the Assassin BY A MILE in terms of fun. Easy to apply, high DPS that is comparable to Warrior if not better (you'll hardly notice a difference anyway as both are incredible). More builds, more fun, better looks. Then again... personal opinion.

Marverick · Jan 25, 2009, 03:30 AM // 03:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crom The Pale

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/6...lashdpskt4.jpg

The standard D-Slash build leaves a war with 3 option slots that can be use for party buffs such as "save yourselves" or extra damage skills. Because of his high armor a war can more easily rely upon a monk for healing where a sin must bring some self healing and defencive skills in order to survive.

Hitting the same button over and over hurts my fingers =P at least for a Sin I have 4-5 buttons to choose from when attacking =P

Mr Emu · Jan 25, 2009, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Masmar

2. Assassins are more complex, they require you to complete a chain, which could at times be hard. What part of the chain making things easier did you miss in my explanation? For example some players wont even notice they missed an attack and will hit 2-4 more skills to no effect. You'd be surprised. Actually, the fact that people are fcking retarded and blind doesn't surprise me in the least.
3. Assasins are all about solo maneuvers, or chains would be useless. For some reason things like overextension or temporary lack of healing seems to bend assassins over in a rather convincing manner.
4. A poorly played assassin IS much worse than a poorly played warrior due to less armour, bad dps, and the player not playing to an assassins needs Even with these detractors, a shitty sin player still has huge damage chains with kds to rely on if they can get them off, and if they can't get them off, they just keep trying until they get lucky. A warrior on the other hand has to actually do something as mentally straining as target swapping, interrupting, or even hitting a bulls!

12char12char

Icy The Mage · Jan 25, 2009, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Nothing stop an assassin from taking [save yourselves!] on their bar.

Windf0rce · Jan 25, 2009, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crom The Pale

The standard D-Slash build leaves a war with 3 option slots that can be use for party buffs such as "save yourselves" or extra damage skills. Because of his high armor a war can more easily rely upon a monk for healing where a sin must bring some self healing and defencive skills in order to survive.

Nope, I disagree. Have done lots of higher end PvE stuff on an Assassin and never used defensive skills to succeed. The key is knowing when to go in a mob, and having the correct team setup. The remaining slots on an Assassin Moebius/DB bar can bring utility just as fine as Dslash, SY! included, or even more offense/mobility skills.

That being said, the Assassin is obviously more fragile and a Warrior has possibly more room to make mistakes.

Might be just me and personal bias towards Assassins, but their DPS is still feels a bit better than Warrior's in PvE.

Did anyone ever try Dslash on a sin? lol just curious on how would it fare...

fenix · Jan 25, 2009, 03:52 AM // 03:52

Dslash on a sin would require using a sub-par Sword. Worst idea ever.

Plus, there would be NO way to improve on a Warrior Dslash bar by running it on a Sin.

A11Eur0 · Jan 25, 2009, 03:57 AM // 03:57

People are forgetting that Moebius strike only recharges skills when hitting a foe at half health or less. In PvE, normal enemies die too fast to take advantage of Moebius, and bosses don't lose enough HP by the time you hit Moebius for it to recharge. Then there's heals. Once that Moebius hits and DOESN'T recharge, your dps ends, you have to go back to the original chain all over again. Warriors can just pile damage on no matter what the enemy's HP is and switch targets mid-"chain" without skipping a beat. That and warriors can stay in that fight longer without having to worry about taking too much damage themselves due to their much higher armor level. 116 vs physical, and elemental with sentinel's insig, plus 10 more against the element/damage type of choice. Sins are stuck with 70+whatever their insignias give + 7 max for the subpar weapon mods.

I'm also going to call BS on Crom's screenshot...I've never hit 90+ dps for more than a couple hits with a customized sword with just d-slash. I averaged 80 with a conjure. You probably had a smite hero with strength of honor and judge's insight bond you while you did the numbers. You can win this argument without cheating, you know.

Anon-e-mouse · Jan 25, 2009, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

I'm also going to call BS on Crom's screenshot...I've never hit 90+ dps for more than a couple hits with a customized sword with just d-slash. I averaged 80 with a conjure. You probably had a smite hero with strength of honor and judge's insight bond you while you did the numbers. You can win this argument without cheating, you know.

Part of the clue is in the picture... Health regen of -1.. Crom was using a vampiric sword.

fenix · Jan 25, 2009, 04:54 AM // 04:54

I can hit a good 120DPS with Dslash, Conjure and S&H. Easily.

Crom The Pale · Jan 25, 2009, 05:07 AM // 05:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by A11Eur0

People are forgetting that Moebius strike only recharges skills when hitting a foe at half health or less. In PvE, normal enemies die too fast to take advantage of Moebius, and bosses don't lose enough HP by the time you hit Moebius for it to recharge. Then there's heals. Once that Moebius hits and DOESN'T recharge, your dps ends, you have to go back to the original chain all over again. Warriors can just pile damage on no matter what the enemy's HP is and switch targets mid-"chain" without skipping a beat. That and warriors can stay in that fight longer without having to worry about taking too much damage themselves due to their much higher armor level. 116 vs physical, and elemental with sentinel's insig, plus 10 more against the element/damage type of choice. Sins are stuck with 70+whatever their insignias give + 7 max for the subpar weapon mods.

I'm also going to call BS on Crom's screenshot...I've never hit 90+ dps for more than a couple hits with a customized sword with just d-slash. I averaged 80 with a conjure. You probably had a smite hero with strength of honor and judge's insight bond you while you did the numbers. You can win this argument without cheating, you know.

I never need to cheat.
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/7941/gw876kg6.jpg

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/4650/gw875sa3.jpg

These two screens were done as a comparision of 20/20 sundering vs Vampiric.

Masmar · Jan 25, 2009, 06:26 AM // 06:26

@ Mr Emu: And i explained that chains can make thins harder
@Icy: All melee playing HM should

pingu666 · Jan 25, 2009, 09:27 AM // 09:27

the 46dps was from autoattacking and remaining degen i think, ill go check
the master of damage doesnt die, so assassins promise runs out....

http://premium1.uploadit.org/pingu666//gw021.jpg

i checked, 46~dps from auto attack and degen, degen on its own is 14dps. damage doesnt include deep wound i think...

nice dslash build

Improvavel · Jan 25, 2009, 09:40 AM // 09:40

Dragon slash this, moebius that... [Earth shaker] owns. [[Earth shaker] even own [[Save yourselves] with a buddie with [[dark fury].

Tyla · Jan 25, 2009, 10:17 AM // 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Masmar

2. Assassins are more complex, they require you to complete a chain, which could at times be hard. For example some players wont even notice they missed an attack and will hit 2-4 more skills to no effect. You'd be surprised.

If they don't notice they missed an attack they should become better at observation. If you miss with an adrenal attack, want to know the downfall? It's not charged anymore.

You'd be surprised at how much paying attention makes a difference.

Quote:

3. Assasins are all about solo maneuvers, or chains would be useless.

Only with combos build to kill and retreat.

If you're using MS/DB you just choose the most sturdy one.

If you're using D-Slash (and really, I'd have Whirlwind Attack on that bar because it's more powerful than Death Blossom because of the ability to buff it further), you're dealing more damage than the Moebius Strike using an O-D-MB combo OR an L-O-D-MB combo. SnM is also another factor, and this is also unblockable.

Quote:

4. A poorly played assassin IS much worse than a poorly played warrior due to less armour, bad dps, and the player not playing to an assassins needs

Less armour? Well well, it's usually people like you saying "LOL CRIT AGLITY IS GUDDER DAN WORIOR IAS".

Bad DPS? You know that this thread is about DPS, right?

A poorly played Warrior isn't worth taking because the utility will probably be wasted.

You're only worth arguing with for the comedy of it.

As long as Warriors push out more utility with the DPS being better under certain circumstances, they'll be better at both.

blue.rellik · Jan 29, 2009, 02:45 AM // 02:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenix

Dslash on a sin would require using a sub-par Sword. Worst idea ever.

Plus, there would be NO way to improve on a Warrior Dslash bar by running it on a Sin.

NUH UH!!!!

A sin can get more crits!!!!111one!11!